2006 soakers

[Samael]

You guys have some really true points. Last month I went into k-mart looking for the "Biggest Super soaker" they had. It was my last day in high school and most of the guys had bought what looked like helix's and vaporisers.

At the time my knowledge of SS's was small because I hadn't kept up since the late 90's, so I saw the biggest one there, the triple aggressor. (It's a piece of junk! and now its trigger is also broken)

Anyway I was shocked to find not a single soaker cost more than $40 (AUD). Its funny because when I was a kid I remember seeing really expensive soakers up to $200. I was shocked about this and later on found larami was no longer doing the SS but Hasbro took over.

I agree with others when they say the 2006 line will include basically the same shit as now, with new wrapping. Thats really cynical but its my prediction, I doubt Hasbro will make an expensive gun with 20X nozzle because its not cost effiecient for the company to spend money on a R&D team. Plus their focus seems to be on younger kids with not so much money to spend. Piston based guns are cheap and satisfy most 10 year olds, they are what sells and makes the company what they are. They have no need in pursuing a nice new CPS blaster with specs of the CPS 2000 because that will cost, and wont sell to the masses.

There's my cynical 2 cents, and I hope for all our soakage, I am wrong.



Edited By Samael on 1131697527

[ZOCCOZ]

Your Hasbro cynicism is realism for some of us, so don't worry about it. isoaker is one of the few I know here who is generaly optemistic, which is actualy a refreshing and posetive thing.(But I have to admid that it weirds me out abit,isoaker. )

USA Hasbro is a monopoly buisness giant. Making stuff cheap and selling relative high is what they do. (Turning Transformers Diecast Binaltech to Plastic Alternators is one example.)
But if I would be in their position, I might be corrupted to, probably buying of the competition and only producing and selling squirt guns that are a tad better than what you get at 99 cent stores. In other words re-introducing new generation to 60s-80s squirt pistol technology. With all those kids and young adults having A.D.D and sub-standard regard for history, it might just work.

Has anyone heard anything about Lanard? All I have seen were X-Stream double packs of 2004 models this year.



Edited By ZOCCOZ on 1131700792

[isoaker]

I haven't seen anything new from Lanard this year. Then again, it seems they come out with newer stuff every 2 years as opposed to each year.

As for being optimistic, well, if I were as jaded as many here seem to be, iSoaker.com wouldn't exist anymore. However, my views on water and waterfights tend to be a little different than some others here. I'm always wanting to push for better performance and such from water blasters, but while I find those I know having a great time using them, I'd rather enjoy the moments than dwell in the negative. Sure, there are those who justifiedly would prefer to have harder hitting, farther reaching soakers. My soakage power-lusting side would love to feel the blast from a higher-powered soaker as well, but from experience, even soakers only as powerful as the CPS4100 or CPS2500 were enough to deter those not really familiar with water fights from actually wanting to try them! To my surprise, I've found more preferring soakers along the sizes between the XP310/Max-D6000 to the CPS1200/WW Blazer. Smaller lacks the power and capacity while larger is usually felt as too heavy and unwieldy. Of course, for the online Soakerdom crowd, some may not understand this, but one needs to understand that the majority of soaker buyers are not hard-core soaker enthusiasts. General needs are different.

That said, I should still hope there is some room in the budgets of the soaker manufacturers and soaker sellers to try to get at least one or two 'higher end' soakers on the market for those craving more water power. As said many times before, due to safety limits, even the best soaker a manufacturer can make will likely be insufficient to some here since their power is capped for safety. However, I'm digressing.

I'm always trying to push for better quality, better designs, and general better performance. Feedback that I compile and forward to those I know on the manufacturing side spans everything from styling to soaker feel, durability, comments on plastics used, weight, balance, and such on top of just the raw soaker performance stats such as output and range. On top of that, I both acknowledge a particular soaker's strength while pointing out areas where I feel a soaker could have been improved without having to change too much (i.e. changing nozzle selections, moving of intake tubings, reshaping grip regions, etc.).

The 2005 lines were a step in a promising direction. I can only hope things continue to improve over the coming years.

[LIGHT ANNIHILATOR]

USA Hasbro is a monopoly buisness giant. Making stuff cheap and selling relative high is what they do.
But if I would be in their position, I might be corrupted to, probably buying of the competition and only producing and selling squirt guns that are a tad better than what you get at 99 cent stores.

I have probably made this point 5 times already, but here we go again. People will buy whatever hasbro makes, whether it's Flash Flood's or cps 1200's they will buy them. Because they're a monopoly to a certian extent they can charge whatever they want for their guns. (like charging $20 for a $6 piece of crap gun, where the trigger breaks 2 week's after you bought it.)





Edited By LIGHT ANNIHILATOR on 1131712756

[ZOCCOZ]

USA Hasbro is a monopoly buisness giant. Making stuff cheap and selling relative high is what they do.
But if I would be in their position, I might be corrupted to, probably buying of the competition and only producing and selling squirt guns that are a tad better than what you get at 99 cent stores.

I have probably made this point 5 times already, but here we go again. People will buy whatever hasbro makes, whether it's Flash Flood's or cps 1200's they will buy them. Because they're a monopoly to a certian extent they can charge whatever they want for their guns. (like charging $20 for a $6 piece of crap gun, where the trigger breaks 2 week's after you bought it.)

Thats not entirely true. While its common knowledge that the consumer mass is as dumb as they come, price and competition manufacturers will affect the sales aswell. Anyone remember the EES? The shelves where still stocked full with those at the end of August 2003. In other words, the consumer zombies rather want to buy cheap crap than expensive crap. This is the reason why Hasbro ditched the large expensive soaker idea. So it could be said that the consumer mass buys whatever, aslong its cheap and apearing like a good deal. A Splashfire for $20 would not sell and end up like the EES sales.



Edited By ZOCCOZ on 1131749618

[DX]

AKA money is king. After all, that's all people care about anymore. I'm a quite pessimistic person because the morals of this country have made me so. There are more things in life than money, status, power, and control. I could be the CEO of a monopoly power and still never be corrupted by such leverage. Quality will never return unless something drastic happens; a boycott, a big change in management, a large economic swing. Crap guns are here to stay until some other variable give way.

Here's a thing to do: start your own water gun company. I actually would, but that would require majoring in engineering and/or business. I would rather major in History or the Classics, I am not a science/math oriented person. Startup capital would be costly, not to mention manufacturing space and offices. But that is one of the best ways to show discontent with products and bring it to the attention of the public.



Edited By Duxburian on 1131764546

[m15399]

If you made your own company, you'd probably go out of business, competing with Hasbro. Anyways, you'd be sued for making a gun that blew some little kid's eye out. ???

[DX]

Better than being ignored and viewed as just another insignificant individual whom can't make a difference. But making your own company sends the most powerful message. Creating competition is the way to strike at the heart of any hubris company. Like in a water war, taking the initiative from them will help you survive. To help avoid lawsuits over power, make some crap guns for the little kids, but also make some with real quality and power behind them for those serious about water warfare. Too bad it's so difficult-such a goal is possible, even if you do have to fight every inch of the way.

Now I realize that Hasbro could turn around and produce some good stuff along with the others in each year's line to keep us happy. But they don't and won't, despite the fact that a giant company like Hasbro easily has the extra funds to do it. Hubris, bent moral values, and economic conditions continue to work against us.

Personally, I'm sick of it. They produce cheap quality guns and expect us to buy them anyway like always. Eventually something has to give. Not business as usual. To the equally dissatisfied: keep boycotting until companies produce something you like. Why buy a product that preforms much worse than something you can build or mod yourself? Until the gap evens out a bit more, why turn back? In this day and age, companies like to think that they control us, the consumers, and they can do what they want. Well it should be the other way around, but sadly a lowly individual has no power.

Boycotting and building your own guns at least sends a message that you don't like what they are doing and are concerned enough to take matters into your own hands. The individual needs not worry about building to safety standards, so you can put as much power in as you want.

So keep ignoring us, Hasbro. Discontent tends to snowball, discontent sparks innovation, discontent brings down the corrupt and arrogant via economic means.

The Progressive in me bids the buyer caution when considering the 2006 line. Buy only if you truly like the guns, not just because there's no alternative. There always is another way. If 2006 isn't up your alley, mod or go homemade. If 2006 meets your expectations, that's great. If you're on the fence, take all of this into consideration.

[LIGHT ANNIHILATOR]

The power and quality of gun's will increase, because Hasbro has seen how well the slightly more powerful Ste line has sold, so maybe they're thinking that making a more powerful gun will increase sales more.

[DX]

2006 may be a pivotal year. If the guns are good, I may buy, if the guns remain bad, I will continue my boycott of soakers made in 2003, 2004, and 2005. So far it has been hinted that ranges have not been improved, cutting the chances of me buying any by at least 90%. I'm personally looking forward to 2007 more than 2006, because range improvement seems to have been ignored yet again and I'm angry about that.

[LIGHT ANNIHILATOR]

I am more focused on output than range right now, 35ft would be fine with me if the output was good, besides if you want more range: that's what the k-mod and cvf are for.

[ZOCCOZ]

Here's a thing to do: start your own water gun company. I actually would, but that would require majoring in engineering and/or business. I would rather major in History or the Classics, I am not a science/math oriented person. Startup capital would be costly, not to mention manufacturing space and offices. But that is one of the best ways to show discontent with products and bring it to the attention of the public.

Personal vast Money necessarly is not a must to start your own buisness or production. You can try to find investors in banks or certain privat sectors. Of course you would need a good lawyer who will prevent the investors to screw you over. Plus you would need a proto-typ model and certain angle to pitch your concepts.
Of course it sounds all easier than it is, but not an impossibility for people who really want to start a franchise.

Now having said that, if the frachise fails, the investors will rip that person a second butt crack.



Edited By ZOCCOZ on 1131778248

[isoaker]

Uh... firstly, Hasbro is doing what it knows best to do; make and advertise products towards the younger crowd. Good water guns would fall into the realm of mid-teen to late-teens at least in order to be able to use a larger soaker well (exceptions exist, but I'm talking for average build people). Mid-to-late teens likely spend more money on clothes, music, and videogames and very few would be concerned with buying a particularly good water blaster when a mediocre one would do fine for the odd pool/water fight they may be involved in.

This isn't to say there isn't a market, but Hasbro seems more skilled and experienced at promoting to the younger audience so... that's the bulk of what's seen these days.

That said, they are starting to remember the older crowds, but it may take both time and consumer feedback to let them know that large soakers can still sell well.

Also, while Hasbro is the big one, don't forget about Buzz Bee Toys which is made up of a lot of the guys who were once in Larami prior to Larami disappearing. BBT is one company that seems more geared to trying to make better soakers for the older group, though they are still restricted by resources. There's no point in making great soakers if you end up bankrupting your company in the process of doing so.

Yes, ideally, one prefer quality and would hope companies aren't just money-oriented, thinking solely about the bottom line. However, without money, a company cannot survive, thus even if they want to make quality blasters, no money, no blasters. All this talk of starting a company requires money!

It's a fine balancing act... it's easy to complain about things, but unless you can come up with a working solution, complaints don't add up to much.

For those questing more power, as has been mentioned before, you'd need to build your own soaker since homemades are often more powerful than manufacturer safety standards would allow as well as likely cost more to build than the mass-produced soaker. For those wanting manufacturers to make more powerful soakers, we need to get more older individuals interested in soaking to increase the demand for more powerful soakers so that companies see that they can still turn a good profit if bigger soakers are made and sold in stores.

[DX]

as well as likely cost more to build than the mass-produced soaker.

I am getting to the point where my homemades are starting to cost the same or actually less than a manufactured soaker. I pay $15-40 for each APH I make, which is close to the $20-30 for a Flash Flood, Aquapack, etc.

As for BBT, they have more potential, but Big Bee did hint that range was not improved for 2006, alienating one customer. I am considering buying the shotgun type soaker they have for '06, but a homemade can still do that job the same or better. All homemades have a big riot blast, from 20-60x or more, depending on the size of your pc . On the smallest homemades, you can deliver that riot blast in only 3-5 pumps.

I am way too far in to turn back, but I still would like to see some improvement in stock quality.

[isoaker]

Don't mix up sale price for actual cost of manufacturing. The actual manufacturing cost for a soaker is much lower than the retail price. However, due to advertising costs, R & D costs, other company costs, shipping, retailer profit, the actual retail price is much higher. The cost you've noted are solely raw material cost. You have yet to factor in your time and energy both learning how to build as well as building the soaker. All these sort of things add into the selling prices of soakers.

[LIGHT ANNIHILATOR]

My 200th post.

we need to get more older individuals interested in soaking to increase the demand for more powerful soakers so that companies see that they can still turn a good profit if bigger soakers are made and sold in stores.

Either that, or get the young one's to put down their Flash Floods, and pick up thier Monster XL's, if you know what I mean.





Edited By LIGHT ANNIHILATOR on 1131843343

[isoaker]

First full week of December and we've still not heard much about the newer lines. Granted, Big Bee gave us a little insight into the upcoming Water Warriors line, but I'm surprised that those down in New Zealand and Australia haven't seen the new line-up yet. As well, Hasbro/Super Soaker has been rather silent. Sometimes, the odd new soaker appears somewhere online at this time of year. Hopefully we'll hear more soon...

[sbell25]

I somehow don't think we're going to get the line first this year. I remember seeing the first prechargers in the stores around September last year, but I haven't seen anything new in the stores so far this year. In fact we're only just beginning to get the 2005 Super Soaker line in shops (at about 2-3 times the price of what you guys pay).

[LIGHT ANNIHILATOR]

I really don't think we will hear about the new line untill next year. I'm also not very anxious to see the new line, because Big Bee told us not to expect much improvement.

we're only just beginning to get the 2005 Super Soaker line in shops (at about 2-3 times the price of what you guys pay).

That's just insane, even with the exchange rate I find it crazy to pay nearly $40 for a Flash Flood.



Edited By LIGHT ANNIHILATOR on 1134077904

[ZOCCOZ]

I haven't seen anything new from Lanard this year. Then again, it seems they come out with newer stuff every 2 years as opposed to each year.

When where the last recent Lanard soakers produced? The large Cobra AirPressure model was 2003. Was the Mega Snapper a 2004 model? Does anyone know what the date on the actual model sais? The Blastmaster 660 seemed to come out earlier than 2003, since it was used in a 2002 review.
Anyways, this year where mainly old models in combo packs. It would be interesting seeing a new line in 2006.