1-3-5 internals and modding

[darthmeow]

The trigger on my 1-3-5 snapped off today. I think that the heavy trigger spring may have something to do with the problem. The trigger on my 1-3-5 only has to be pulled about 1/4 of an inch to fire the center nozzle, but it has to be pulled very hard to fire the other nozzles.

The (broken) trigger:





Nozzles:


Note the lack of a return spring on the firing valve.



I already tried a nozzle drill on the center nozzle, and it now fires a ~10X stream with very bad lamination about 25-30 feet. I had a PVC coupler on it so it could use a 5mm hose nozzle, which increased range to about 35 feet. I had to remove the rings around the nozzles to open it and so had to remove the coupler to get it open. It did not need the other nozzles plugged and I could still fire the other nozzles while firing the center nozzle.

[the oncoming storm]

I wouldn't have drilled it past 5x, Are you planing on K modding it? you just might clear 40' if you did.

[marauder]

You should be able to fix the trigger with some epoxy and some metal strips along the sides. The strongest reinforcement would be on top, but that would interfere with how smooth the pull is since it goes over top of the pump. In regards to range, I may be wrong but it looks like the length of the whole firing valve mechanism may be a major factor in keeping range low. The stream has to go 2-3" before leaving the nozzle. That's never a good thing unless it's going through a laminator, and even then, that's probably too long for optimal performance. Nice internals pictures btw.

[darthmeow]

I plan on using this for close range soakfests, so range is not a problem. I think that you probably need to get rid of the whole nozzle assembly to get maximum power. By the way, this thing can tap shoot really fast if you are firing the center nozzle, since you only have to pull the trigger a tiny bit.

[soakinader]

I believe if you plugged the outer 4 nozzles and pulled the trigger back all the way, you might get better range and power out of the centre nozzle. Try using small nails or hot glue for a test shot. *EDIT* I have opened my 1-3-5 and determined that this is not the case!
In theory, with the outer 4 plugged and the center drilled, you should be able to increase the output/range depending on how far you pull the trigger. Of course it might also make little or no difference, meaning that there isn't a reason to plug the outer nozzles after all.
If I ever get a 1-3-5, I'm going to make all 5 nozzles shoot parallel, forwards.

[darthmeow]

The trigger is now fixed with some devcon and 2 metal wires:


I also took some shot pics now that it is repaired:





I have not measured range, but I would guess about 30-35 feet.

This is also my 100th post

If I ever get a 1-3-5, I'm going to make all 5 nozzles shoot parallel, forwards.

That is a really good idea, especially for soakfests. It would also be pretty effective for other gametypes if you K modded it.

[marauder]

Congrats on your 100th post, it was definitely a good one! The central nozzle definitely looks like a shotgun type blast. Was this your intent? Mind if I put this on Hydrowar and direct conversation from the site to this topic?

Also, it seems like the 1-3-5 has a lot of untapped potential. I wonder if it'd be possible to make 5 parallel 5x nozzles. That would seem to have good range and would be super difficult to dodge.

[darthmeow]

The shotgun nozzle was not my intent, but it does work well. I checked range and it is fairly bad, only around 25 feet maximum. I am going to add a PVC threaded nozzle selector, which should work well so I can use the hose nozzle I have. Feel free to put it on Hydrowar.

[soakinader]

Also, it seems like the 1-3-5 has a lot of untapped potential. I wonder if it'd be possible to make 5 parallel 5x nozzles. That would seem to have good range and would be super difficult to dodge.

That would be an amazing weapon. I'm sure you can make the nozzles parallel. You would have to put a colossus'd CPS 2500 PC or something into the 1-3-5 to give it enough power for 5 by 5X though... and it still might just explode.

[soakinader]

So as some of you know (and some of you don't) I bought a CPS 1-3-5 from my favorite VV for 4$ a while ago.
Unfortunately, one of the nozzles has broken clean off.

Also, it appears to have some kind of leak/trigger problem as well. I won't be able to work on it for a while, but I would like to think about modifications for it.

The one nozzle is broken off, gone. I don't think there is much left to affix some sort of nozzle onto. At this point, I have some serious questions about what I am going to do with it. Maybe I could cut off both outer nozzles and make it shoot at a 90 degree angle?
I think I would still like to drill the nozzles, and cut/straighten out the inner nozzles to point forwards... however, I am currently looking for an idea of how the stock spread looks.
Also, is light K-modding an option? I bought a small package of balloons but I honestly don't know enough about the 1-3-5. All I know is they have troubles with modifications. I don't want to lose the ability to shoot on all three settings if it still can.

[HBWW]

I heard the 1-3-5 has bad HPL, so any K-mods would be very limited unless you were to cut the PRV.

I'd primarily opt for the nozzle mods if I had a 1-3-5. For me, I'd probably slice off the side nozzles and plug them up with epoxy and some leftover material in order to reduce dead space, although simply plugging the side nozzles with epoxy should work too.

[darthmeow]

This is the stock spread:


I really need to finish modding mine. I plugged the two middle nozzles but got only a small range increase. I think maybe today i'll glue the final 2 nozzles and experiment with getting a better seal on the center PVC coupler so it doesn't leak. I actually really like the way the stock nozzle setup works, even though it's really impractical.

[the oncoming storm]

I almost want a CPS 1-3-5 now... Almost

Currently I want a stock 2700 more.

[Nemesis]

@storm: a 2700 you say? and why is that?

@Darthmeow: awesome. If you have another spherical PC CPS perhaps you could try an integration. Who knows, one of the smaller spherical PCs could give it more PC capacity as well as range.

[DX]

I modded a 1-3-5 on contract years and years ago. From what I remember, the HPL is low and the stock bladder is weak, but huge. I replaced it with a 21K PC and that hit something like 42-44ft, with 20? 30? balloons. I don't remember if I drilled the center nozzle. That mod is where I got that idea that a 1-3-5 is a poor man's 1500. You can get a 1-3-5 to be fairly powerful, enough so to be usable in wars, but it still only approaches the power of a stock 1500. The PC is huge, the reservoir is huge, it has good things going for it, but it's also so top heavy and jiggly that it's not ideal for prolonged battles.

[Nemesis]

Interesting. Perhaps, if one had a 1-3-5 and a 1500, you could switch the firing mechanisms, the PCs, and possibly the pumps to get one gun with the best of both worlds. The by product would be an equivalent to a more fragile 1-3-5 with less capacity that looks like a 1500. Then again, it may not be so easy. They aren't veritable clones the way the 2000 and the 2500 are, so some mutilation may be required.

[DX]

1500s also come in at least 2 incompatible marks, I am making a future picture guide that shows how different they are (you can't even swap the nozzle selectors). Whether ordinary 1-3-5s have this variation is kind of unknown. Mark-matching with these guns is kind of a shot in the dark. 1500s have the more solid platform, so there's no much I'd really consider swapping with a 1-3-5.

[soakinader]

@Darthmeow, nice pic. How far apart do the streams land from each other, and how is the range on the center nozzle compared to the side nozzles? I guess what I want to know is, do you wish your 1-3-5 had a tighter spread or a wider one? Or is it just right?
I think I can throw 20 balloons on the 1-3-5 without causing issues... maybe?

[darthmeow]

I don't remember what the spread was, it has the nozzles plugged now. I wish it had a much tighter spread (think burst nozzle/shower nozzle)

[marauder]

I like the idea of the three streams. Five is cool to look at, but a bit unnecessary. This would actually be fairly useful so long as you could get it to shoot 40+ on all nozzles.