Chokehold scenario

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Ox-11
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Chokehold scenario

Postby Ox-11 » Mon Apr 01, 2013 10:53 am

Game duration: Until objective is completed.
Game type: OHK
Objective: (I quote isoaker) Leave NO ONE dry! (No, not yourself)
Armament: Colossus
Enemy Armament: Shot Blast x1 Rattler x1

You start off behind a 5' tall tree line meant for privacy. Your battle zone is a 70' by 120' property, with 50' by 35' house in the middle. To the east of the house there is about 15' of space and to the west there is about 6'. On both the east and west side there is a hose.These two hoses are your only source of water other than what you already have. How would you go about eliminating the two opponents guarding the hoses? (The hose is ok to use as a water gun.)
Last edited by Ox-11 on Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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the oncoming storm
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby the oncoming storm » Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:48 pm

My plan wait for at least one of them to abandon there hose and take it over there is no weigh that I can force them to give it up with my primary, but once there just stay put odds are they won't be dumb enough to give it up again, they don't stand a chance.
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby Ox-11 » Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:58 pm

Sorry about not clarifying earlier. There is a way to force the hose user to abandon post due to the fact that the hose source is 20' behind the south wall, meaning that your primary can force the hose user away.
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby the oncoming storm » Mon Apr 01, 2013 4:19 pm

I never would abandoned the hose if under attack due to unlimited capacity, you would need elimination rules or a CPS class weapon before you could even think about charging a hose successfully.

Off topic training really does matter, just today Marauder OWNed me 6 to 3 with a much weaker gun simply because he was much better trained
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby Ox-11 » Mon Apr 01, 2013 4:32 pm

Game type was one hit kill/ eliminate if you did not see game type

Off topic: Isoaker did a comic about a guy who practiced shooting on stationary targets, and he was completely drenched
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby the oncoming storm » Mon Apr 01, 2013 4:46 pm

Somehow I had missed that, it makes all the difference in the world, head for the weakest player stay at your max range and hit them before they are close enough to fire back using the hose as you out range them. only rush if they are away from the hose because Air pressure guns have higher rate of fires (if you tap shoot) than pistons can ever hope to have making them much better at short charges use this to take out your foes if they come after you.
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby SEAL » Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:46 pm

Well it depends on what kind of nozzles the hoses have; without a nozzle most hoses shoot like 30 feet, even though they have a lot of output. However some jet nozzles can probably hit close to 45 or 50 feet with maybe 10X output, so if the hoses were equipped with them, I'd have to avoid direct combat with them. Without a good nozzle, I could easily overpower them, as hoses restrict mobility. If they do have a powerful nozzle, I would simply try to lure the enemies away from the hoses and take them out. It shouldn't be that hard to do.

If they don't take the bait I might try to attack one of them (the Shot Blast user), attempting to get him/her tangled up in the hose and unable to dodge my streams. The Rattler user will likely come to aid, in which case I'd go after that person instead, who I should be able to take out without much trouble. From there on out I could use the other hose if need be.

As for training, the best way to get water warfare experience is simply by fighting a lot. Forget about target shooting; that's just for real warfare where you obviously can't, haha, train by fighting against another person (though I hear that some fighting forces practice with airsoft guns)...
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HBWW
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby HBWW » Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:39 pm

The original scenario did not mention water bottles nor water balloons, but since I'm always at the ready when it comes to those two pieces of equipment (at least two bottles in pocket, and a small bag of a dozen unfilled balloons or so; they're of negligible space and weight unless you lack an extra pocket), I'll just include them in my plan.

The idea here in general will be to lure the opponents as well as try to trick them on where I am. Without a teammate to help with this, the latter will be too difficult to pull off, so the former strategy will be the only one with a chance of working.

Assuming the hoses are long enough to reach the north and south ends of the house, but too short to get to the other end of the house (another factor not mentioned), I would probably try to lure one of the teammates over, then pick up the hose and blast him. That said, the opponents are unlikely to charge or follow me since I have the range advantage, but they may try some teamwork movement tricks to take me down. If they tried this however, it would give me a small opening of timing to charge backwards around the house and get to their hose, but then we'd just end up swapping positions.

If someone is a hose nut and insists on staying at it, then that's when you have a stalemate. Technically, both hose users could slug it out on the north or south end of the house. In this case, a very risky move could be to try to lure the hose using opponent forward as far from the faucet as possible, make them think you're hiding, then dash around the house quickly (but quietly) to shut off their faucet. (After shutting off your end first on the way around the house, of course.) With both faucets off, charge against the opponent and use your superior range to eliminate him, or at least camp and lure him into a bad spot for him.

Alternatively, one can fight hose users the trickier way. Take advantage of the hose user's reduced mobility to use a water balloon and stream combo attack. Real difficult to do without teammates, but if the hoses aren't VHS's or anything with range (and are just traditional garden hose handles), you have a clear range advantage with the water balloons.

Training. In real warfare, Airsoft/paintball is good for team/tactics training, but obviously useless for marksmanship. Luckily, we don't have that problem here, so fire away. That said, from the community season opener, I have some training ideas to try.

- Practice footwork. A lot. Jump, move, step about. Build an auto-turret that shoots water or darts if you can, or get someone else to do it. Build up your ability to dodge; it will be super useful against the all-too-common tap shots people fire in water wars but will also help you out against tricky-to-dodge short-sustained shots.
- Practice running. Both long-distance and short fast-as-you-can sprints. Pretty self-explanatory and obvious.
- Practice carrying. Bulk up and be able to carry more without hindering mobility. More water lets you make more moves and push opponents around. Of course, this advantage can be substituted by different ways.
- Practice charging and shooting. Attacking someone in water warfare is more than just pointing a blaster and pulling the trigger. It is quickly charging in and out of their range to make the shot, how you ensure you're less likely to be hit, and how you can get away. You can practice this against stationary targets, just pretend that they're moving about and/or can attack you in return. Along with this, practice being able to make your blaster look non-threatening to "attack mode" as quickly as possible. In other words, while you normally point the blaster towards the ground (which tells opponents that you're not ready to attack or counterattack at the very moment), be able to raise the blaster up quickly, shoot, and lower it. Of course, this isn't necessary, but it can be effective if used properly. (DX should be able to explain it better since he does it all the time.)

Now back to hosting wars, if you're playing against inexperienced or incapable opponents, pick a blaster that isn't your favorite high-range CPS so you can continue to challenge and improve your skills.

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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby Nemesis » Mon Apr 01, 2013 9:57 pm

Every time you fight, you learn new manuvers, and you also test your skill and battlefield knowlege. Obviously, being in good physical condition is good, but to get better at fighting, nothing compares to real combat.
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HBWW
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby HBWW » Mon Apr 01, 2013 10:22 pm

Indeed, I wouldn't be able to refine training techniques without actual combat and seeing how some of the seasoned veterans fight. Basically, training is anything you do when you're bored and want to have a water war, but can't for whatever reasons.

Ox-11
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby Ox-11 » Fri Apr 05, 2013 9:15 pm

Water scenario battlefield.png
Water scenario battlefield.png (16.34 KiB) Viewed 649 times


Congrats, CA-99, you got both and won. Seal is runner up due to the fact that he went down with one hose user. Martianshark you must forgotten how close they were to the hose and was blasted by one hose in the front and back. Apparently most of you think that they're going to abandon their hose for a underpowered water gun with less capacity and range than your's (in this scenario of course) and would probably be driven back to the hose anyway.

Sorry about not getting the map online earlier. The green star is your spawn point, the red star is your opponents, the blue X's are the hoses, and light green means light vegetation.
One map square is 10 feet by 10 feet.
Scenario Two: One man trio
Duration: Until game is over.
Gametype: 3HK respawn and the other team must have at least 3 fist sized sploches each to win.
Opponent number:3
Opponent armory: Empty Shot blast: 1 Empty Rattler: 1 Full Shot Blast: 1
Your Armory: A Colossus (only one PC's worth of water in the PC, resevoirs dry), and you've already used all your spare water bottles and balloons.

You won that round with flying colors, EXCEPT that you hosed an innocent kid. :sucker: He went and picked up his shot blast, filling it along the way. He then challenged you to a duel, and with this in mind, the two you defeated joined back in. The hoses have a glaring limitation that I missed, it's that the east hose cannot reach the other hose but the west one can, but the west one takes two people to operate.
Last edited by Ox-11 on Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Chokehold scenario

Postby HBWW » Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:08 pm

Well, that explains a lot. Now, to adjust my strategy for the new/updated scenario...

The new conditions are quite a change. Since I am not confident that I'll get to either hose before the opponents do, I'd take a different approach; instead of rushing to a hose, scout first and let the other guys take the initiative.
- Start off by hiding behind the light vegetation (assuming it can provide concealment) and scouting the east hose to see who approaches.
- If all opponents are concentrated in one area, refill at the hose opposing them. (i.e. If no one is there and all are at west hose, refill at east, and vice versa.)
- If opponents split up, remain concealed and wait until opponents move about for an opportune moment. If the opposing team keeps a gunner at each hose, your job will be much more difficult.
- But since we welcome a challenge, we'll assume this is the case and that you cannot refill easily. Worse yet, the battlefield borders prohibit you from running around and flanking from the back, at least without being seen. Plus, going inside through the house is rude and you may be heard anyways. (You don't want anything indoors to get soaked in case the blaster leaks at all anyway.)
- Now, I cannot tell how large each grid square is supposed to be, so I'm just going to say they're 10ft * 10ft or 100 sq ft.
- Which means any hose user at either side of the house is within kill range if you sneak up the front face of the house.
- Since we assume the enemy split up, we attack the side of the house that only has one opponent, instead of two. we know which one is which because of our scouting earlier.
- Using the last of the PC, we attack the lone hose gunner, using the cover of the house to prevent from being hit or from being seen too early. This is the one move that can't be screwed up, and it relies on the hose user not wandering too far from the faucet. (If they do, you can likely charge the faucet and shut it off, then attack the gunner.)
- Upon elimination of the hose gunner, get to it and fill up quickly! Listen for opponents to see which side of the house they approach from. Be ready to shoot them if they appear, which is tricky, but possible, while refilling.
- The rest of the game repeats similarly to what happened earlier. There may be lots of circling around to gain control of a hose, as well as standoffs between the players.
- However, with a full PC, you can skirmish the other team. Perhaps you may need to gain control of a hose, but that may result in a stalemate.

There's a problem here though, that I haven't accounted for yet. The opposing team could drag both hoses out to the front to deny movement around either side of the house, and trap you in the front yard. This is the risk that must be taken if you choose to stay behind and scout, but if you try to rush for the hose at the beginning of the match, the west one seems to make the most sense. The sprint isn't too long, so you may be able to get to it before an opponent is able to have it ready to shoot at you. It's still a risk though, and if you choose this method, you must be ready for the case where the opponent reaches the hose first. I think it's a 50/50 chance of either problem happening, to be honest. Just because the opponent is using bad blasters doesn't necessarily mean that they're bad players.

Perhaps you get lucky though, and manage to 1. avoid getting trapped in the front yard, and 2. refill your blaster. What to do from there?

Lure. The appeal of controlling both hoses is high for the opposing team, so stay near the one under your control, but leave the area a bit to tease the opponents. Use your instinct; if someone goes after the hose you just apparently abandoned, then charge] back there and try to get a hit first! Very tricky to time especially if one of the opponents is on the opposite side of the house.

Now, if the opposing team controls both hoses while you're in the backyard, that isn't as bad as it'd be if you're in the front, thanks to the positioning of the backyard vegetation that gives you a chance to sneak up against the east hose/faucet.

Tricky scenario overall; one that requires a lot of quick decisions and has a lot of limited options due to the incredibly small playspace.


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